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Re: OT: Mismatched phonologies / accents

From:Peter Collier <petecollier@...>
Date:Friday, January 25, 2008, 1:03
----- Original Message -----
From: "Benct Philip Jonsson" <bpj@...>
To: <CONLANG@...>
Sent: Thursday, January 24, 2008 4:37 PM
Subject: Re: Mismatched phonologies / accents

> If the language having the inventory is some kind of pre- > Old High German I'd expect /s/ to be apical [s_a] (like > in modern Spanish and Greek), and /z/ not to exist[^1] > and thus: > > /ts/ > /T/ > /dz/ > /D/ > /S/ > /x/ > /Z/ > /j/ or /G/ > /tS/ > /S/ > /x/ or > /tj/ > /tt/ (/t/ word initially) > /dZ/ > /Z/ > /j/ or /G/ or /dj/ > /dd/d/
Well spotted, the inventory is PGmc. The /s/ is [s_a], so I suppose to be ultra precise I should list WRom [s_m] > NRom [s_a]. /z/ of course had earlier rhoticised to /r/, I'd forgotton about that! In which case then I guess I'd also need /z/ > /s/ [z]. Do you think [z] would ultimately devoice and merge with [s_a], or would it survive long enough to become a separarte phoneme again? I'm not at all sure about /tS/ > /S/... and /dZ/ > /Z/... The whole point here is I am trying to establish an 'accent', i.e how the Romanic sounds are mispronounced by a Germanic speaker beacuse he lacks the correct phomenes in his inventory. As he doesn't have /S/ or /Z/ either, any sound change that uses them, even as an intermediate stage, is surely precluded as he can no more pronounce those sounds than the original ones. Could /tS/ and /dZ/ 'jump' straight to /x/ and /G/? Given the choice of sounds available, /tS/ and /x/ certainly seem to be the closest sounding, but dZ sounds equally close to /G/ and /j/ to me (assuming I try to avoid the 'un-Germanic' palatal /tj/ and /dj/).
> BTW I'd expect Latin /k/ before /e, i/ to become /ts/dz/ > so that /tS/ would rarely arise -- perhaps only from /kj/, > and I do regard /j/ as the most likely outcome of both > /Z/ and /dZ/. Some think VL /g;/ actually first went to > /j/ everywhere!
Yes, I have /k/ > /ts/ _/i e I E/. I also have /ts/ < /tj/ and /kj/. Some others are derived as follows: /dZ/ < #/j/, #/dj/, /bj/, /ndZ/ < /mj/ /tS/ < /pj/ I'd also completely fogotten about /L/ My guess is that would go to /j/, although maybe /r/ is a possibility there? Pete