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Re: R in the nordic countries was: Re: Ergativity/Apologies

From:Chris Bates <christopher.bates@...>
Date:Tuesday, August 19, 2003, 19:44
Its easier for me to pronounce a uvular r in some positions than my
normal one yes... I think it has to do with my dialect of english. In my
dialect (non-rhotic) rs that are word final or followed by a consonant
are not pronounced or I can't think of any examples anyway... I find it
very difficult to pronounce my native r in that kind of position and
tend to insert a short schwa as I said after it if I try. But for some
reason I don't have a problem pronouncing uvular r in most positions
(but not all positions... etre in french always gets me, as christophe
said I think its the sonority priniciple... was that what the list
called it? the actually pronunciation is etR... I tend to end up with
etR@_X...) where I can't pronounce my native r. I've never been good at
rs though, I can't really pronounce any others... I can pronounce or at
least get close to quite a lot of non english sounds, especially the
back of the throat ones for some reason... but I can't manage most rs.

>>Date: Mon, 18 Aug 2003 23:41:26 +0100 >>From: Chris Bates <christopher.bates@...> >>Subject: Re: [CONLANG] R in the nordic countries was: Re: >> >>No matter how hard I practice I am not actually able to pronounce my own >>english r properly when it is not followed by a vowel. If I try, I get r >>followed by a short schwa.... however, I can pronounce uvular r when its >>not followed by a vowel. Its not a matter of laziness... I just have >>real difficulty with learning most r sounds, I've tried very hard to >>learn how to pronounce an alveolar trill for spanish and because its a >>common sound in languages or seems to be, but I just can't make my >>tongue vibrate like that. Maybe I'll get it in another year or so... I >>can always hope. >> >> > >So it's actually easier for you to pronounce an uvular r than your normal >one?! I'm sorry; I thought you thought it was closer to the trilled one, >which I don't think it is, and suspected you felt it sounded in some obscure >way more "foreign", in which I could not see any point, since it sounds exactly >as unusual in Finnish. >Epenethetic vowels are not too bad either, though. They are quite common >in dialects (and sometimes even lengthened). > > > > >>Date: Mon, 18 Aug 2003 23:51:20 +0200 >>From: Andreas Johansson <andjo@...> >>Subject: Re: [CONLANG] R in the nordic countries was: Re: >> >>Quoting "M. Astrand" <ysimiss@...>: >> >> >> >>>(As for Swedish, by the way, I have lately picked the common habit to >>>realize >>>/rd/, /rl/, /rn/ as [r\`d`], [r\`l`], [r\`n`], which I truth to speak >>> >>> >find > > >>>rather ugly sounding, but like the way it *feels*... ;) ) >>> >>> >>Where's that common? In Finland? >> >> > >At least in Southern Finland, as far as I can hear, and I think also for >some people on Åland. Of course, I have no opportunities to do any deeper >dialectical studies. >The other possibility is, of course, [rd], [rl], [rn], but my (vague) impression >is that it is somewhat less common among natives - or perhaps it really is >just Finnish accent. > > > >> Andreas >> >> > >- M. Astrand >"Neeba." - "Teeba?" - "Qeesvefar la:lka." - "Djo:ly." >"Guess what?" - "What?" - "I've learned how to speak." - "Great." > >_____________________________________________________________ >Kuukausimaksuton nettiyhteys: >Yli 12000 logoa ja soittoääntä: > > >