Re: English notation

At 07:58 AM Friday 6/29/01, you wrote:
>Tom Tadfor Little wrote:
>
> > I say /i:NglIS/ (remember we were conflating N with Ng)
>
>I'm confused.  I've never heard that pronunciation from any native
>speaker --
I've never heard anything else, except during a two-year stay in Britain.

>although I know some Brazilian and Russian language students
>who sound a leetel like this.  ;-)
Glad the smiley's there. "little" is [lItl=] (or actually [lIdl=]) for me,
but <ing> is *always* [i:N], although I won't defend the length of the
vowel, just its quality.


>I tried that several times and I find myself sounding goofy.  /INlIS/,
>on the other hand, flows off the tongue nicely and effortlessly.  I seem
>to dwell on the /N/ rather than the /i/.
Sounds like British pronunciation to me.

> > most non-phoneticians
> > would probably tell you that "English" and "rely" both have a "long E".
>
>Even an average American, who knows as good as nothing about
>linguistics, would have to realize after some contemplation that the
>sound in "English" is the same as in "bin": a short, lax /I/.
On what basis do you say that? For everyone I know, the sound in "English"
matches the sound in "bean", not "bin". That's what I hear TV announcers
say, too, unless I'm deluding myself (always a possibility!)

>Switzerland.  =)  I don't häf de tippickel Sviss äcksent, dough.
>(Pronounce ck as an uvular affricate...)
<grins> I had a Swiss babysitter long ago--this brings back fond memories.

Seriously, though, it's been my experience that Europeans, even when they
learn American English, tend to have some British characteristics in their
speech as well. Major differences, like the pronunciation of "r", short
"o", and "a" are observed, but more subtle things, like the pacing with
which syllables are articulated, or precise qualities of some vowels
(particularly in unstressed syllables) are likely to follow the British
pattern.

>Hmmm... could the Spanish influence from the border have something to do
>with your /i:NglIS/?  ;-)
Again, I'm glad the smiley's there! Actually, I was raised in the
California Bay Area, and I can't distinguish my accent from that of
national TV and radio announcers.



David wrote:

>In my dialect, I can't have any "short" vowels before /N/ or /r/ except
>for I can have /Er/, as in "air". I say /i:NglIS/, definitely, and mostly
>/r@laj/. I totally disagree with all those "rules" that say words like
>"singer" are pronounced /sINr=/, or, even worse, /sINgr=/, and that "fear" is
>pronounced /fIr/. No way! If anything, "fear" has two syllables in my
>dialect: /'fi.jr=/. So, where's everyone else? I guess I'll read the rest
>of these e-mails and see.
Yep. Exactly. /sINr=/ to me is almost confusing, like someone who can't
decide whether they want to say "singer" or "sinner".

Cheers, Tom




>
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Tom Tadfor Little            tom@telp.com
Santa Fe, New Mexico (USA)
Telperion Productions        www.telp.com
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Reply