Group Conlang (was: Re: a Conlang, created by
|From:||Mathias M. Lassailly <lassailly@...>|
|Date:||Sunday, October 11, 1998, 9:13|
Herman wrote :
On Sat, 10 Oct 1998 14:07:55 -0300, Pablo Flores
> <fflores@...> wrote:
> >c) Case markers are prefixed (Carlos and Mathias both proposed
> >this, and we the others have stayed silent), so adpositions have to
> >be postfixed according to b).
> But my proposed system has gender/number prefixes and case suffixes. I =
> didn't have time to get around to it last night.
Yes, we have noticed that some prefer suffixes and others prefixes... from the very
first post of our project :-))
In my last post I propose to vote on such issues.
If the poll is not quite reflecting your preference, please tell us.
> >Finally, I think we could begin creating some words... This is
> >a big step, but necessary to try these wonderful theorical
> >structures we've made up. For my part, here are some (to be
> >discarded later, if you want to).
> >frar- "dog"
> >kjak- "bite, bit"
> >wiv- "red"
> >s- "I, me, first person"
> >qaun- "hard, strong"
> Examples for some of these might be useful, especially since "hard" and
> "strong" have numerous meanings in English.
> >Case markers:
> >a- agent
> >pe- patient
> >di- predicate
> >ys- undergoer
> >mu- modifier
> I don't especially like pe- or ys-.
I know you artists take great care of that :-)
Ok, why not limit the first mock case tags to VOWELS ? Nobody will complain it's
not nice, (which will be inevitably the case with consonants, I know that much
> >Other markers:
> >-o, -i (dummy gender markers)
> >-ul past tense
> >-e present tense
> >_afraro pesi dikjakul_
> >a-fraro pe-si di-kjak-ul
> >agent-dog patient-I predicate-bite-past
> >"The dog bit me"
> Iin the case system I proposed that would be:
> a-frar-a s-u kjak-ul
> the-dog-agent I-patient bite-past
> or using -u as a perfective suffix, and putting the tense on the noun:
Ditto : I propose vowels (or consonants ?) as suffixes
> a-frar-ul-a s-u kjak-u
> the-dog-past-agent I-patient bite-perfective
> a-frar-a s-ul-u kjak-u
> the-dog-agent I-past-patient bite-perfective
> >_ysfraro diwive_ or _ysfraro muwive_ ?
> >undergoer-dog predicate-red-present or modifier-red-present ?
> >"The dog is red"
> >Is "being red" a real predicate? Or should we use a modifier
> >in final (verbal) position to rended the "to be" copula?
> Being able to distinguish predicates from modifiers might be useful for
> word order flexibility: we could say "the-dog red-modifier" for "the red
> dog" without having it be confused for "the dog is red".
Yes, that's the very difference between 'vocabulary' and 'sentence' to make it
short and jargon-less.
> >Note that if stems always end in a consonant as we decided,
> >at least a postfixed inflection will have to be added in order
> >not to produce invalid syllables such as _kjak_ (stops are not
> >allowed in syllable-final position). This should be gender for
> >nouns, and tense for verbs... at least a generic tense.
> or aspect.
Yes, I prefer aspect rather than tense, because it's easier to show tense with an
adverb or a noun, and easier to show aspect affixed to verb (see Japanese,
But Pablo and others will like tense affixes, so I'm OK with that.
> >A final example:
> >jol- "leg"
> >la "in" (postp)
> (specifically "in" as "location of action", or can it also be used for
> >_afraro jolo la pesi dikjakul_
> >"The dog bit me in the leg"
> >_jolo la_ "in the leg" is before _pesi_ "me" because it's supposed
> >to modify it somehow (it's my leg, not anyone else's).
Hold on : you're mixing here
absolute attribute : my leg (vs. relative attribute : 'my house' vs. 'my home')
indirect patient : I'm bitten to the leg
spacial semantic meaning of words : in = in the inside part of the leg, or : at the
leg, or : on the inside of the leg (in case of empty leg :-), or : through the
inside of the leg, etc
isn't it a bit too early ? :-)
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