Re: Vozgian orthography

--- John Cowan skrzypszy:

> I recommend that /G/ be represented by the ordinary Cyrillic GHE
> (U+0413/U+0433), and /g/ be represented by the GHE WITH UPTURN
> (U+0490/U+0491).
Good idea. I'm not particularly fond of this letter, but I must admit that it
makes sense here.

And Yitzik writes: "Or GHE for /g/, GHE WITH UPTURN for /G/. It depents on
their frequency."

Good point. Well, since the difference in frequency between /g/ and /G/ will be
obvious (something like 10:1), I think I will follow your suggestion.

Should I understand that you guys don't like the idea of Cyrillic G with
crossbar? AFAICT, in certain Central Asian languages it represents an uvular
fricative?

> As for /T/ and /D/, they can be nicely represented by ES WITH
> DESCENDER (U+04AA/U+04AB) and ZE WITH DESCENDER (U+0498/U+0499).
That is from Bashkir, right? I even found a romanisation scheme of Bashkir that
includes eths and thorns! (http://www.geocities.com/Athens/9479/baxkir.html).

Basically, it is a good suggestion. However, I am not entirely convinced yet
that it is really what I want. First of all, because these characters suggest a
logical connection with "s" and "z", something I deliberately want to avoid;
and secondly, because in my perception they look a bit to Asiatic, while
Vozgian is supposed to be spoken somewhere in North Eastern Europe, between the
Nasesk Vesemir and the Komi Republic.
I would rather prefer T with descender, but that would cause the problem that
Cyrillic D has already a descender of its own (two, actually). Or perhaps T and
D with crossbar. But I don't know how probable it is for a Cyrillic script to
import a non-Cyrillic character rather than to use one that exists for another
language. Hence my question about the likeliness of eths, thorns, and Greek
thetas in a Cyrillic alphabet; they look more "European" to me, even though
Bashkir could provide Cyrillic characters.

When it comes to Vozgian orthography, perhaps I should extend my question a
bit, since my dilemma is not limited to /T/, /D/, and /G/ only, but also
touches some vowels:

/&/
* Ä (a with diaeresis), until now my favourite option
* Æ (a-e ligature). I found it in Unicode's Cyrillic listing,
  but I have no idea if it is actually in use anywhere
* @ (schwa): used in some Central Asian Cyrillic scripts

/2/
* Ö (o with diaeresis). Exists in Komi.
* Barred O (U+04E8/U+04E9). Looks too much like Greek theta to me.

/y/
All I'm sure about is that it will look like <ü> in the romanisation. I am
still wondering what to do with the Cyrillic spelling of the triangle /i/, /1/,
/y/. At this moment I have been thinking about something based on the Ukrainian
model:
/i/ - Ukrainian-Belorussian i ("our" i)
/1/ - Russian i (reverse N)
/y/ - yeru ("61")
However, a few alternatives are available for /y/:
* straight u (U+04AE/U+04AB), found in some Altaic orthographies
* Cyrillic u with diaeresis (U+04F0/U+04F1)
Obviously, a choice for one of those would also affect the orthography of /i/
and /1/, since in that case Russian i for /i/ and yeru for /1/ would be more
likely.

In general, I see two possible models:
Either a Central-Asian-based version, with s-descender for /T/, z-descender for
/D/, schwa for /&/, barred o for /2/, etc.,
or a more European version, possibly with eths, thorns, and diaereses (for
vowel that are, indeed, umlauted).

While the Central-Asian model is probably more Cyrillic (in this sense that all
characters are already in use somewhere) and more efficient, something inside
me rebels against the idea. Probably the fact that it doesn't really seem to
fit with the fact that Vozgian is a Slavic and not an Altaic language, and with
the location I have in mind for it.

Jan

=====
"Originality is the art of concealing your source." - Franklin P. Jones

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