Theiling Online    Sitemap    Conlang Mailing List HQ   

Re: A short passage.

From:Kinetic <kinetic_wab@...>
Date:Tuesday, March 15, 2005, 2:54
B. Garcia votuala:

> I'd sent this early this morning but it didn't seem to make it to the > list for some reason (I checked the archives). So, here it is again.
Looks like it finally came through - I got the original just over two hours after receiving this one. :-)
> I wasn't sure how to translate "will be condemned to die" exactly > since Ayhan lacks any sort of verb for "to be". My best guess was the > "causative" affix for the verbs, which is usually used for saying > "caused something to happen". This was a lot trickier than I thought.
After reading your post I decided to do a translation into my own lang, Kontaxta, and the issue you describe is tackled in much the same way: I took the verb "to die" ("mute"), and made use of a handy verb of mine, "ahkoe" ("to move uncontrollably, inescapably"), which is generally used to express being "doomed" in one way or another: muteni ahkoe "to move inescapably towards dying" i.e. "to be doomed to die" Then I put this in the causative: muteni ahkoanou "to cause to be doomed to die" i.e. "to condemn to death" Then into the passive: muteni ahkoanouseu "to be made to be doomed to die" i.e. "to be condemned to death" This seemed to fit the original quite well. :-)
> Also, where I've written "act-nat" means "active natural". This is in > there because Ayhan distinguishes verb subjects which are natural or > unnatural, active, or inactive. Natural generally means things in an > untouched or unprocessed state (a picked vegetable is considered > "unnatural", but "natural" when still in the ground). Active things > are usually things that show some sign of movement or development > without the hand of man (usually) or a god or spirit (meaning the > spirit or god doesn't take an active role in manipulating it).
Interesting idea. What about, say, a vegetable accidentally unearthed by an animal? Is that "natural" because its state is as yet uninfluenced by human actions, or is it "unnatural" because being unearthed is an unnatural state for a vegetable? Anyway, before I go, I'm gonna take this opportunity to offer my Kontaxta translation for the extract in question: þa mutanoule tou koðuale tou eðiaqe vÿøsale ma, mutali vÿsei telen kÿsÿnuven nøðeu. hiþoyua etuyase ka eki teula, luvoate kortaqi xivaken sia sÿlote kokulen vona muteni ahkoanouseule. you die-CAU-FUT incl_or steal-FUT incl_or old_one-DIR damage-FUT NEG, death-of danger have-GER begin-NEG-GER so_that. this-law disobey C2A every person, river-in stone-with drown-GER excl_or water-in boil-GER because die-GER-to be_doomed-CAU-PAS-FUT. IB.