Re: theta roles and ergativity in a fairly isolating new language [longish]
|From:||Joe Mondello <joemond@...>|
|Date:||Wednesday, October 16, 2002, 23:15|
Nathaniel G. Lew writes
> On Tue, 15 Oct 2002 19:57:33 -0400, Joe Mondello <joemond@...>
> >The matter becomes fairly confused when dealing with subordinate clauses:
> >ki nu [(nu) súdo pi brame]
> >ki nu súdo pi brame
> >hope I find Det horse
> >I hope I find (by looking) the horse
> >ki mo nu-z [nu súdo zúyo]
> >hope mother 1s-Gen [1s find work]
> >My mother hopes I find work
> >Thus far I think this is fairly reasonable. The hairy part is that when
> >subject of the subordinate clause is the experiencer, the subject andverb
> >of the main clause follw the verb of the subordinate clause (follwing
> >this?), e.g.:
> >súdo-ga ki mo slívil-o
> >find-Fut hope 1s money-PL
> >I hope I will find/happen upon a substantial sum of money.
> I am confused. Should that example be
> súdo-ga [ki (nu)] nu slívil-o
> ?Sorry about the mistake, that should have been "súdo-ga [ki nu] slívil-o".
After I wrote the email, however, I thought long and hard about this
system, and changed it substantially. Mind you that a lot of what I say now
may not jive with the last e-mail, but that's the creative process, you
> (You gloss "mo" as "mother" above.) Also, what if the experiencers of the
> two clauses are not co-referential? That is, how do you translate "I hope
> that my mother happens upon money?" Is it something like this:
> súdo-ga [ki nu] mo nu-z slívil-o
> ?No. The subordinate clause would essentially be re-rendered as a NP meaning
"the X-ing by Y to Z". when subject=agent, it is marked with the suffix -nu
(which comes from '-na wi' 'to exist with'), When subject=experiencer, the
Direct object is marked with the genitive. e.g.
pi mo-nu [súdo-ga slívil]
Det Mom-Nom find-Fut money
The "will find money"-ness of/by mom (sub=agent)
pi [súdo-ga mo-nu] slívil-za
Det find-Fut mom-Nom money-Gen
The "mom will find"-ness of money (sub=experiencer)
It should be noticed that I've changed the 1s pronoun to 'e' so that I dont
have to say 'nunu' all the time. That being said, "I hope my mother
happens upon money" is
ki e-nu [pi [súdo-ga mo-nu] slívil-za].
want 1s-Nom [Det [ find-Fut mom-Nom] money-Gen].
Relative clauses work use the relative particle be in-situ:
ki e-nu [pi (i) [súdo-k' mo-nu [slivil
want 1s-Nom [Det (i) [find-Perf. mom-Nom [money Exist-Rel(i)]]]
Sometimes compounding even occurs in this way, e.g.
Rel-in sleep=be-me trisko> bémetrisko> bímetox=bed
I think the system works fairly well but there's something about the method
of subordination that sets off an alarm in my brain.
> - Nat