Re: Chris, Chris and Chris

John Cowan saakel:
>> That's illogical. There are two possibilities: Jesus told the truth
about
>> Himself, or He lied (and would probably have been insane in this
case).

> *That's* illogical.  People are usually not "knights" (who always tell
> the truth) or "knaves" (who always lie).  Even if they never lie by
> intention, *some* of their statements may be in error.
_Your_ statement is illogical. Being God* on earth is boolean**; there's
no middle ground. If Jesus was confused about being the Son of God, then
He couldn't have been the Son of God. But then, what happened to His
body? If the apostles took it, why did they die for what would then be a
lie? If the Jewish priests or Romans took the body, why didn't they show
it to the rioters a few days later to stop the riots? If Jesus didn't die
and merely fainted, how did He take off 75 pounds (33 kilos) of linen,
rearrange them neatly, move the tombstone (which was limestone and
weighed several tons), disable two or more guards (not the story type
that just run around being humiliated by the protagonist), and get food
and medical attention in time to live on? He had a spear stuck into His
ribs!

Then there's the matter of people seeing the posthumous Jesus. He
appeared before doubters (Mary Magdelene thought He was a gardener, and
Thomas said he'd have to see Him to trust that He was alive), which
severely limits the possibility of hallucinations; He appeared to groups
(once to eleven disciples, once to twelve, twice to small groups, and
once to five hundred people) and the people in the groups remembered it
identically, which rips the remaining hallucination argument to shred.

You're saying that Jesus might have been confused about His godhood? He
sounded pretty certain: "Are you then the Son of God?" "You are right in
saying I am." (Luke 22:70) Anyway, I was considering "lie" = "any untrue
statement", whether intentional or not.

You said "people are usually not...." Jesus was anything but usual.

The amused, and bemused if you can think that Jesus was uncertain about
His identity,
Christopher Wright


*God is three; God is one. Seems illogical, but so does altruism to a
puma (we're not smart enough to understand). Jesus, the Holy Spirit, and
God are all God. God said, "I am God Almighty"; God also said, "Let us
make man in our image", and the Hebrew word for him is plural (*Elohim,
right?).

**Boolean: having only true or false as possible values. There are many
cases which seemingly should be boolean but aren't. Take, for instance,
the set of all sets that do not include themselves. Does that set include
itself? If it included itself, it couldn't include itself, but if it
didn't include itself, it would have to. However, being God is most
definitely boolean.

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