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Re: L1 learning question

From:Tom Wier <artabanos@...>
Date:Monday, September 28, 1998, 6:07
Nik Taylor wrote:

> > "toser" -> "yo toso" > > "mover" -> "yo muevo" > > They're unpredictable, but I wouldn't call them *irregular*, simply > because they *are* so common. It's sort of like the Strong Verbs in Ol=
d
> English, which were only semi-predictable.
But this to me just seems to beg the question: how does one tellwhen to = draw the line on just what is predictable? The Junggrammatiker of the last century made the great advancement of linguistics that language is rule based, that there are no, or almost no (in the weaker formulation) irregularities or exceptions. The problem with the strong verbs in OE is that they represented an unproductive paradigm in the language: in this sense, they were regular, though the rule regulating their change was more or less deep into prehistory (OE had no ablaut to my knowledge). But if you use the normal meaning of "irregular", then they were just that.
> Also, I've read a suggestion that the basic form of the verb in Spanish > be considered to be the infinitive *and* the third person singular > present indicative, i.e., instead of just saying "mover" as the basic > form, you'd say that the basic form was "mover/mueve", which would > automatically make most stem-changing verbs "regular", with a few > exceptions like "tener". Third person was chosen because first person > singular often has additional irregularities, like _tengo_ and other > "-go" verbs.
The Latin grammarians explained their language essentially in a similar way: certain forms of the verbs were based on certain stems (the present stem, the perfect stem, so forth). This is the reason that if you go buy the book "501 English Verbs" (yes, there really is such a thing), it will list the four English principle parts for every verb. German is of cours= e much easier, as (almost) all present tense irregularities can be explaine= d by umlauting the stem vowel (_ich laufe_ "I run", but _er l=E4uft_ /loift/ = "he runs"). =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Tom Wier <artabanos@...> ICQ#: 4315704 AIM: Deuterotom Website: <http://www.angelfire.com/tx/eclectorium/> "Cogito ergo sum, sed credo ergo ero." We look at [the Tao], and do not see it; Its name is the Invisible. - Lao Tsu, _Tao Te Ching_ Nature is wont to hide herself. - Herakleitos =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =0D