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Re: New Langage "Tyl-Seok": Similar ideas? (Was: Translation pattern of `to have'?)

From:Henrik Theiling <theiling@...>
Date:Wednesday, March 7, 2001, 12:49

Tommie L Powell <tommiepowell@...> writes:
> Those "following sentences" weren't in your post to me, > but I believe I've found them in your March 5 post to > Christophe Grandsire. Here's what I found there:
Yes, errm, exactly. Sorry, I must have messed up my posting somehow...
> Its rules that apply to prefixed nouns only tell how each > such noun is related (by its prefix) to some particular noun > that precedes it. Within each such 2-noun relationship, > the preceding noun can be regarded as the agent of the > noun whose prefix relates them, and that prefix's noun > can be regarded as the preceding noun's patient, and that > prefix can be regarded as playing a quasi-verb role, so > "active SVO structure" is inherent in those rules at the > local (2-noun) level.
Well, on phrase level, not 2-noun level, I thought about something similar just yesterday for Tyl-Seok: I thought that the basic structure of `agent verb patient', which needs two grammar rules, could be reinterpreted as `controller controllee' (which only needs one rule). I did not try very hard to find problems, but I do not think there are many (it is meant to be configurative anyway, so in `agent verb patient', the part `verb patient' is a sub-phrase, which might as a whole be the controllee of the agent). So maybe it is just a point of view. I came up with this alternative grammar description when Christophe pointed out that `to drive' in `man drive car' is superfluous. With the A+V+P analysis, I would have to decide whether in `man car', `car' is a verb (`man.AGT car.V'), or a patient in a phrase with no verb (`man.AGT <null>.V car.PAT'). With the controller-controllee analysis, the difference is not so important.
> But a single noun can be (and often > is) both the patient of a preceding noun and the agent of > a following noun,
Could you give me an example? Is it like (monospaced font): Tyl-Seok: tired man work Structure: [tired.V man.PAT].AGT work.V Reference: \________/ English: The tired man works.
> Unlike your particles, my prefixes cannot be omitted.
Redundance alert!! :-)) **Henrik