Re: Language and "mysticism," whatever that is.

--- Yoon Ha Lee <yl112@...> wrote:
> On Sat, 28 Apr 2001, Sally Caves wrote:
> > Vyko, Conlangers!  I've taken a long long holiday
> (which
> > essentially amounts to doing my dayjob at the
> university).
> > I hope you haven't forgotten Teonaht!
>
> <hesitantly>  Vyko!  Definitely haven't forgotten
> you, or Teonaht.  :-)
*perplexed* Vyko?! (what is Vyko??)  I'm a newcomer,
hi!  Hyyva: voa! (in my conlang Vya:a:h)

> > 1)  How many of you old- and new-comers started
> inventing a language
> > in isolation from the list?
>
> I did...
In the progress now...

> >         1a)  If so, how old were you?
> Er...I was in 6th grade.  That would've made me,
> um...12?
Around age 19, 1st year college (university).
Started to consider it, but never acted till just
recently!  (25 now)

> >         1b)  Was it a project with friends or a
> solitary project?
> Solitary.
Ditto...

> >         1b)  Did your invented language have some
> kind of private purpose?
> >                 esoteric?  erotic? religious or
> mystical?
> It wasn't much of a language (essentially a
> quasi-French clone, since
> that was the foreign language I was taking), but it
> was associated with a
> private dreamworld that also wasn't much of a
> dreamworld and was largely
> based on the goings-on in Diana Wynne Jones' _Fire
> and Hemlock_.
No, not at all.  Just something fun to do...  Plus, I
was sick of looking at all those complicated Japanese
characters, and thought "hey, English/western tongues
are too simple & sloppy; Japanese/eastern tongues are
too rigid & tough... why not create a blank slate, a
medium between the two parts of the world?!"

> > 2)  How many of you newcomers heard of the list
> first and thought--
> > Wow! I think I'll try my hand at conlanging!
>
> Alas, no; I hit the Language Consruction Kit and
> that was what inspired
> me, mostly to resume "for real."
Hands up..

> > 3)  How many of you, when you were starting out on
> this on your own,
> > did this kind of thing:  you have a list of words
> you want to invent
> > new ones for, so you drew di-and polysyllabic
> words out of the air.
> > This is
> > what I did when I was new at this and a teenager.
> Many of these still
> > remain vocabulary words in Teonaht, but I've since
> then learned to build
> > up through word roots. Pretty much, yeah.
Nope, I like to pull simple root words from natlangs
(at the moment I'm focusing on about 6 of them from
various families), add a secret dash of Vya:a:h (said:
"v-ew-a" where "ew" resembles "Jew" and "a" resembles
American way of saying "Abbey" --- Yoon Ha, can you
show me the correct linguistical notation for this??),
then voila!  From those roots, build... but I haven't
got to that step yet...
>
> > 4)  If so, how important was it that the new word
> sound "exotic,"
> > "beautiful," or
> > "suggestive" in some personal way of the word you
> wanted it to stand
> > for?
>
> "Suggestive" is more important, though for certain
> concepts I also want
> "beautiful" words (by my admittedly skewed
> standards).
As a rule, that "dash of Vya:a:h" has to be
persistent.  That is the most important aspect for me
- so, exotic may be the answer to this question.

> > 5)  How many of you invented words to express
> concepts that could not be
> > expressed in your native language?
>
> Yup.  Either of them.  :-)
Most definitely, not only in my own lang but also in
those that I've picked up as a non-native and speak
fairly well.  I'd like to construct a medium of many
of these elusive concepts.

> > 6)  How many of you used it for prayer?  For
> secrecy?
>
> Alas, I only used runic "writing" for secrecy.  I
> did, however, invent a
> conscript "cipher" for English for secrecy, but it
> wasn't a conlang.
Whoa, no where near that stage!

> > 7)  For how many of you was it an intellectual
> exercise?
>
> It is now.  Back then, it was just, Neat!
Perhaps, maybe that is why I've been stuck so long...
(hehe)

> > 8)  A language for a conculture?
>
> It is now....
Eventually, for not a conculture but rather an actual
existing portion of society labelled as a
"subculture".

> > 9)  How many of you newcomers (and I see a lot of
> names I don't
> > recognize
> > in the six months I've been away) heard of the
> list first and thought--
> > Wow!  I think I'll try my hand at conlanging!
>
> Wasn't this a previous question?
I agree with Yoon Ha, you asked earlier.  Yep, trying
my hand at conlanging for the heck of it, at this
point in time at least.  Maybe I will become as
skilled at Gray Wizard is?

> > 10)  What is your definition of a mystical
> language?  Would any of you
> > characterize your conlang as such?
>
> I'm not even sure what a mystical language would be,
> even allowing for
> individual definitional variations.  All my
> conlanging these days is for
> conculture/writing/learning about linguistics
> purposes.
> Good to hear from you again.  :-)
Mystical conjures up the typical image of witches &
warlocks, broomsticks & herbs, powders & brews...
hence, a language with lots of x/w/z/g combos and
grave accents.  My dear Vya:a:h fears those
combinations, so we tend to avoid the most
unattractive (--in my opinion!--) letter w and grave
accent, but gladly make up with lots of v & other
consonant clusters followed by vowel clusters and the
diaersis (though Vya:a:h actually holds its own script
- eventually).  It is still easy-to-pronunce though, I
think...  I digress, "mystical language" -- I guess a
natlang like Welsh perhaps might exemplify my image.

> Yoon Ha Lee, relatively pretty much a newcomer
Regards / Matt, an infant just budding in this world
of conlang'ers (or, as we may have agreed in another
email, a.k.a. "Young Matt" so as to differentiate
between myself and other Matt's - if I may be so vain)


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