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LWII: Attack of the Euroclones

From:Costentin Cornomorus <elemtilas@...>
Date:Wednesday, June 11, 2003, 22:07
yscreus il Nikhil Sinha:

> After all these discussions, does Indika > qualify to be a euroclone? > Visit my > site again, > >
I get a site unavailable message. et-z-el Jowan van Stenbergo:
> > --- Padryk Brãziej skrzypszy:
> > > As I understand the term; and as is > > > definded by Henning below (though better > > > than I did!). > > > On the contrary, I think your definition is > > quite good. My only objection is against > > the > > sentence "it closely mimics one or another > > of > > the previously introduced european based > > constructed auxlangs", because it rules out > > Esperanto itself.
On the other hand, Eo is the theme to which all the others are but variations! ;) It therefore can't be a clone of itself.
> > BTW, why don't you add Kerno to the > > collection of
No website for it, which is a requirement. Also, I am strangely hesitant to do that sort of thing. Probably a matter of having no control over the process or the result.
> > > > Rick Harrison: [...] > > > > > > That's more a description than a > > > definition. > > > > My mistake. I should have added to Rick's > > defense that he didn't present it as > > a definition.
> > Cool. I'll be the first to learn Kernanto, > > then!
No no NOOOO! That's "le Kernanto"!!!!! Only the hated and heretical Kernonantistas don't have the article there! You know, they left the Communitats in a huff cos of their claims that the rules governing article use were too nebulous. Typical! They just couldn't get behind the project and make it work!
> > Ha! But no so easy as Wenedyk. All you need > > to do, is learning four > > cases, > > three genders, five tenses, four moods, and > > only a few irregular > > verbs, besides > > practicing the sibilants a bit and > > installing a special keyboard definition on > > your computer!
Holy Saints preserve us! [snip]
> > That just doesn't feel right to me. > > Besides, an additional problem with the > > term euroclone is its pejorative > > connotation. > > No, I think I'll settle for the term > > esperantoids, and leave > > euroclone in its negative meaning.
Fair enough. That would still leave me with only "euroclone". ;)
> > > Kerno, Wenedyk and Brithenig would be > > > Eurolangs; > > > Ia, Ido and Eo would be Euroclones (as > > > well as being Eurolangs). > > > Sure. But it seems to me that the term > Eurolang is redundant, then. > Wouldn't it be enough to call Kerno, Wenedyk > and Brithenig "romlangs"
Sure. But then you need a name for Arvorec, Seimi and Manoueg. They would be eurolangs as well; but not Romlangs! Anyway, we can discuss it all we like, and come up with alternatives to "euroclone"; but the fact remains that "euroclone" is an entrenched term in IAL discussions. And not just by us conlangers. It is in general linguistic currency both with and without overt condescension. I just want to ensure that the IAL v. artlang distinction was understood; and to wonder that Langmaker's euroclone category is woefully inappropriate for the languages in it! Padraic. ===== Et ters davigaint deck y yaithes 'n el drichlend le Roy Markon; y cestes d' ils yspoil morès y ddew chaumèz e-z-el tons l' organón. .


Nikhil Sinha <nsinha_in@...>
Jan van Steenbergen <ijzeren_jan@...>LWII: The Euroclones Strike Back!