Re: TRANS: flutes in PIE

On 2 Feb 00, at 14:47, dirk elzinga wrote:

> On Mon, 31 Jan 2000, yl-ruil wrote:
>
> > On Monday, January 31, 2000 2:24 AM raccoon wrote:
> >
> > Here's another example of Aredos (I'm sure Padraic will provide us with
> > another example of Tallarian if we ask nicely. What does Tallarian mean,
> > BTW?). This is one of many Aredos proverbs:
> > ne ommis cuí caenans habent, caenatores senti "Not all who have flutes are
> > flautists".
>
I'll bite:

In Meynian...

An   laloa     an   tíun  méisunát  oa   poiphiuh  néi  oa   loa  an  tíun
ERG  many.PHR  ERG  he    possess   ABS  flute     NEG  ABS  PHR  ERG he

poipheinát  oa   poiphiuh
play        ABS  flute

/An lAl@U An tU:n meI:sVnA:t @U pOIfUx neI: @U l@U An tU:n pOIfeInA:t @U
pOIfUx/

ERG Ergative
ABS Absolute
PHR "Phrasal" sub clause (using a phrase where a noun should be)
NEG Negative copula, i.e. "is not"

The unmarked meaning of a Phrasal sub clause is defined by the highest
animacy noun within it.  Erm, that's probably not very good terminology, is
it?  Anyone want to help me explain better?

(Almost) literally, in English: "Many flute-owners are not flute players."

NOTE: "Flute" is an unfamiliar concept to the Meynians, I've derived an
agent noun from an ablauted verbal root for "announce" (fairly common
derivation practice in these early days of Meynian vocabulary-building).


This would be a very difficult sentance in Wenetaic as there is a specific
genetive case for "own but not use", which would be pretty much obligatory
(except in the case of a very long-winded periphrasic evidential (and
partly self-contradictory) construction[*]) and kinda take the sting out of
the saying...

[*] roughly equivalent in English to "those people (about whom I have
sufficient evidence to infer that they may be or have been flute-players)
are not all flute-players"!  Very ungood!



---
Pb