Re: Examples wanted: How do you say this?

On Sunday, April 17, 2005, at 06:53 , Mike Ellis wrote:

> Anyone, in conlangs or natlangs.
>
> "With X being/doing A, Y did B."
>
> Use whatever nouns or verbs you like; I just need to see how you work this
> construction.
The first part is an 'absolute' clause.

Natlangs

LATIN
In Latin, the X is ablative case & 'doing' is a present participle also in
the ablative case to agree with X. If A is is a noun or pronoun it will
usually be in accusative case, as it is usually the direct object of
'doing', but some Latin verbs did govern other case.

Example:
eo     imperium  tenente,               euentum timeo
he-ABL power-ACC hold-PRES.PART-ABL
With him holding power, I fear the outcome

There was, however, no present participle for "to be" in Classical Latin,
so the two nouns were just put in the ablative, for example:
  Caesare   duce,    nihil timebimus.
Caesar-ABL leader-ABL
With Caesar being leader, we shall fear nothing.

ANCIENT GREEK
..had no ablative case and normally used the genitive in this construction;
  also, unlike Latin, Greek did have a present participle of "to be"
autou  to kratos     ekhontos,           to apoban phoboumai
he-GEN the power-ACC hold-PRES.PART-GEN
With him holding (the) power, I fear the outcome

Kaisaros   he:gemonos ontos,            ouden phobe:sometha
Caesar-GEN leader-GEN be-PRES.PART-GEN

With impersonal verbs, however, the accusative case was used. Here is an
example from the historian Thoukydides (Thucydides):
       ekson                  ouk e:theele:sate
be-possible-PRES.PART-ACC
[even] with it being possible, you would not do [it]

Ray
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Anything is possible in the fabulous Celtic twilight,
which is not so much a twilight of the gods
as of the reason."      [JRRT, "English and Welsh" ]