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Re: very confused - syntax question

From:From Http://Members.Aol.Com/Lassailly/Tunuframe.Html <lassailly@...>
Date:Sunday, July 4, 1999, 8:19
Dans un courrier dat=E9 du 04/07/99 03:52:33  , Jennifer a =E9crit :

> Should I > make a rule that the verb is inflected for semantic agent instead of > grammatical subject and that "transitivity" as it applies to verb=20
inflection
> is to be defined in terms of semantics and not necessarily what is > grammatically marked in the sentence?
benefactor case =3D points at the one receiving the prize topic case =3D points at the competition instrument case =3D points at the one given/received as a prize ergative case =3D points at the one giving the prize. now you can theme-ize any of them : rusa-k@-mi [ they-BEN kanyase-INS kanyan ] "my brothers they won the prize" king [ he-ERG kanyase-INS rusa-k@-mi-BEN kanyan ] "the king he awards the prize to my brothers" kanyase [ it-INS brothers-BEN king-AGE kanyan ]=20 "the prize my brothers are awarded it by the king" "the prize it is awarded by the king to my brothers" this theme-rheme system is a valid construction for subclauses too in many natlangs. but if you don't like it, you can make correspond voices and cases. the base case (nominative or absolute case depending on your supra-scheme) and the base voice (active=20 or attributive) is not noted here : king-ERG kanyan =3D king kanyan+ERG kanyan+ERG is a transitive semi-factitive verb. kanyase-INS kanyan =3D kanyase kanyan+INS kanyan+INS may be rendered as a passive verb ("to be give/won as a prize") or as an intransitive verb ("to be a prize to") among many possibilities. rusa-k@-mi-BEN kanyan =3D rusa-k@-mi kanyan+BEN kanyan+BEN may be rendered as an oblique passive like english "i am stolen a wallet".=20 so you have now : king he kanyase-INS brothers-BEN kanyan+ERG note that "agent" and "patient" cases may be either the "instrument" or the "ergative" depending on whether your verb is intransitive or transitive. for instance, if "kanyan" is "to give a prize", then you have : king he brothers-BEN kanyase-PAT kanyan but if kanyan means "to be received as a prize" (like many japanese verbs are based) then you have : king he+AGE brothers-BEN kanyase kanyan i don't mention "focus" here because i believe "focus" changes depending on languages. for instance either "content" and "container" are valid focuses of "to fill" in japanese and english. Kinda seems like a cop-out...but
> maybe that is it. I think Kristian's got the right idea; I think I'll go=20
to
> bed and have a nice long chat with my informant.
indeed this is the best way to sort out conlanging designs. mathias