Re: Now that I have it . . .

From: "nicole dobrowolski" <fuzzybluemonkeys@...>
>> One way to counter this is to translate things from several
>> different languages
>> (incentive to learn!), or (if an Earthlang) from languages that
>> would be likely
>> to have some influence on your language anyway (i.e., if Middle
>> English was your
>> conlang you might translate from French).
>
>i'm confused as to what difference it would make to translate things
>from different languages...?  wouldn't the phrase 'i love monkeys'
>technically mean that a person/being/creature/whatchamacalit in this
>case the speaker referring to his/her/it/self has an affection for
>monkeys... no matter what language it was translated into?
Yes, but most works don't consist of constructions as simple as "I love
monkeys".  (One problem with translating "I love monkeys", btw, is the fact that
there may not be _supposed_ to be a word for 'monkey' in your language, which
you might not notice just dutifully translating.)

Take a bit such as.. such as...

    There was a Pig, that sat alone,
        Beside a ruined Pump.
    By day and night he made his moan:
    It would have stirred a heart of stone
    To see him wring his hoofs and groan,
        Because he could not jump.

(from "Sylvie and Bruno" by Lewis Carroll)

Translating this word for word (especially if you don't have the words and make
up them up as you come to them) can have influences:

    Might you try to make the words rhyme
    or fit the same meter as the original?
    or would you convert it into one of your language's poetry styles,
    (reminds me of Prigio, who translated
    "Egyptian hieroglyphs into French poetry for his mother")
    or render it as prose?

    Might you import metaphors and stock
    phrases wholesale, rather than translating
    what their equivalents might be?  i.e.,
    will you create your own idioms, translate
    into plain language, or translate word for word?
    ("heart of stone", "day and night", "wring his hands [hoofs]")

    Might you import semantic distinctions
    and sets of synonyms wholesale?  i.e.,
    does your language even make a distinction between
    "moan" and "groan" ?

    Culturally, would this even make any sense?
    Your conpeople might not be prone to such
    anthropomorphizaton of pigs.  Pigs may be
    taboo topics for something as refined as poetry.
    Your conpeople may not have pigs--do you import
    "pig" with or without explanation?  Or do you choose
    a word for a creature similar to a pig?  Or do you
    choose a word for a creature with a similar
    absurdity level to a pig doing this?
    Do your people use pumps?  .. etc.

You might not think about any of this at all if you just sit down and say:

    (there-is).past (pig).nom, (REL) (alone).nom (sit).past ....

And even if you do think about it, you may still miss things.
This may not be a problem for some conlangs/concultures, but sometimes you might
want a more rigid level of consistency and less outside-worldview coloring.


    *Muke!

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