Re: CHAT : Origin of the name "Northumbria"

On Sunday, November 28, 2004, at 12:05 , Joe wrote:

> Rodlox wrote:
[snip]
>> I always thought it was pronounced "north-umbria"...didn't know about the
>> Humber.
Well, more like "nor-thumbia" really.

>> so, it's actually "nort-humbria" then?
>
> No, it's pronounced as expected.  The /h/ just got absorbed into the /T/.
yep - just like we usually write 'North Hampton' as Northampton and 'South
Hampton' as Southampton   :)

Also _Northumbria_ is really a part latinization of _Northhumberland_ (<--
North Humber Land).
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On Saturday, November 27, 2004, at 10:03 , Joe wrote:

> Andreas Johansson wrote:
[snip]
>> Not from _what_, but from _where_; I'm not interested in the etymology,
>> but
>> _where_ the name was coined, specifically whether in Northumbria itself
>> or
>> somewhere south of the Humber.
>
> Ah, right.  Well, either possibility seems likely to me.  Because
> Northumbria was the union of two kingdoms (Bernicia and Deira), it is
> possible it was a name coined for the new entity by the Northumbrians -
> called so because it now contained all the lands north of the Humber.
That sounds perfectly plausible. The kingdom would have to call itself
something and I've never heard it called 'the United Kingdom of Bernica &
Deira'   ;)

I have tried to check, but haven't so far been able to confirm it - but it
seems mos likely to me that the termed was coined by those in the kingdom
north of the Humber (and south of the Forth) to designate the kingdom.

>
> Or, as you say, it could have been an (exonym?).
Yes, but if it was, what was the 'endonym' ?     ;)

Ray
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Anything is possible in the fabulous Celtic twilight,
which is not so much a twilight of the gods
as of the reason."      [JRRT, "English and Welsh" ]

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