Re: CHAT: affricates/grammar help/intransitivity/free word order

Quoting "Pascal A. Kramm" <pkramm@...>:

> On Thu, 30 Dec 2004 16:29:13 +0100, Andreas Johansson <andjo@...> wrote:
>
> >Quoting "Pascal A. Kramm" <pkramm@...>:
> >
> >> >German has the labiodental affricate [pf]
> >>
> >> Yes, but only in the middle of the word or at the end. Word-initial it is
> >> "f".
> >
> >Many varieties, yes. Duden German, no.
>
> Duden German != spoken German in most areas. Not in all, but at least in a
> lot of cases, so you're better off not taking it as a guideline for anything.
> In essence, the Duden is quite useful to stop a desk or chair from wobbling,
> but it's very unsuitable to make qualitative statements about the actually
> spoken German.
I know that many varieties of spoken German differs from the Duden standard on
this point; indeed, I said so in the very message you quote above. You however,
asserted that intial 'pf' is [f] as an unqualified fact - this is simply false
for a great number of varieties, to which comes that statements on unqualified
"German" will usually be taken as refering to the prescriptive standard.

As for your low opinion of the prescriptive standard, let's say you've got the
point across. I don't care.

                                                  Andreas