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Re: LW again -- Noun and verb

From:Wesley Parish <wes.parish@...>
Date:Thursday, August 29, 2002, 12:45
On Thu, 29 Aug 2002 19:31, Christophe Grandsire wrote:
> En réponse à "Thomas R. Wier" <trwier@...>: > > ========================================================== > > Passive: > > (1) applies to an underlying transitive clause and forms a > > derived intransitive; > > (2) the underlying O NP become S of the intransitive; > > (3) the underlying A-NP goes into a peripheral function, > > being marked by a noncore case, prepositionm etc.; this > > NP can be omitted although there is always the option of > > including it; > > Are you sure about the "always"? I've read about Hebbrew (I don't remember > if it was Modern Hebbrew or not) that it had two possible passive forms for > transitive verbs, one for which the demoted agent could still be expressed > obliquely, another where this was ungrammatical and the agent couldn't be > expressed at all. Would such a construction be denied the name of passive > (when it has the meaning of a passive) just because it cannot express the > demoted agent? > > In my booklet on the structure of languages (where this example comes > from), the definition of passive doesn't require that the agent must be > able to be expressed obliquely. Indeed, it even says that in some languages > the only possible passive form doesn't allow it.
Well, in yhe vala lakha, the passive formed by stem + -ni, is strictly aorist, indicating that the passive has only a narrative function. Expressing the agent isn't a focus, because yhe vala lakha can have active with either minimal focus without or maximal focus with the |ya| topicalizer. The presence or absence of the topicalizer is the equivalent - in single sentences - of the use of the active to enhance or the use of the passive to distance one's self from the action in languages such as English. Wesley Parish
> > Christophe. > > > > Take your life as a movie: do not let anybody else play the leading role.
-- Mau e ki, "He aha te mea nui?" You ask, "What is the most important thing?" Maku e ki, "He tangata, he tangata, he tangata." I reply, "It is people, it is people, it is people."