Re: [wEr\ Ar\ ju: fr6m] ? Am I right??

Apologies for my delayed reply...

--- Herman Miller <hmiller@...> wrote:
> On Sat, 10 Nov 2001 19:33:26 +1100, Tristan
> Alexander McLeay
> <anstouh@...> wrote:
>
> >On Sat, 10 Nov 2001, SuomenkieliMaa wrote:
> >> Now I live in
> >> Ward: Suginami [sugi:nami]
> >
> >Wouldn't that be [suginami]?
>
> I'd guess the Japanese version would be [sMginami]
> or [sMNinami]. Is this
> one of those words that pronounces -g- as [N]?
No, -g- is definitely like -g- of _geiser_ and not
[N].  I'm having trouble distinguishing between [u]
and [M], but from what I guess, [u] is like Spanish
-u- whereas [M] is a bit less refined, sort of like
one is trying to swallow it.  If that is so, you're
right.

> >> City: Tokyo [tO:kiO:]
> >
> >[t_h8ukj8u] for me, but this'll differ from
> dialect-region to dialect
> >region. And I think the point of the excercise is
> to get native
> >pronunciations.
>
> Well, native pronunciations would be appreciated,
> but I'm not native to Ann
> Arbor for instance (I was born in Lansing ["l{nsIN],
> and I've lived in a
> number of states other than Michigan that affected
> my pronunciation). So
> non-native pronunciations and different language
> versions are also
> acceptable. I probably ought to mark non-native
> pronunciations in some way,
> though.
Went to college (ie, "uni" for non-Americans :))) near
Ann Arbor (closer to Toledo), so my pronunciation
would match Herman's for the most part.  I, too,
however, have moved around quite a bit.

> >> Country: Japan [dZ_pA:n]
> >
> >English's pronunciation would be something more
> like [dZ@p{:n], I think.
> >And again, in Japanese?
>
> Something like [nihoN\], I believe.
Not sure I agree about final [N] -- that represents a
typical -ng- like in _song_ doesn't it?  Nihon/Nippon
both end with a forceful -n-.  After [N] I can only
see the yen symbol -- what the heck is that supposed
to be?

> SuomenkieliMaa, do you know how the names are
> written in Japanese
> characters? This is what I get from JWPce's
> dictionary: I'm familiar with
> the characters for Tokyo and Japan, but Suginami is
> unfamiliar to me.
> “ú–{ Japan [nihoN\]
> “Œ‹ž Tokyo [to:kjo:]
> ?™•À Suginami [sMginami]
> (And are these IPA transcriptions acceptably close
> to the Japanese pronuncation?)
Impressed, Herman, by the fact you can produce
Japanese characters.  Chars for Japan & Tokyo are
correct, but Suginami is ™•À.  (_sugi_ is a sort of
tree, I *think* it may be a pine; _nami_ means line-up
or queue).  As for IPA, still not an expert, but as
mentioned above, I disagree with [nihoN\].  Tokyo IPA
I would agree with -- very elongated "clear" o's.
And, Suginami -- well, that depends on if I'm
understanding [M] correctly.

Rgds/Matt33

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