Re: Terminology

At 07:27 23/11/98 +0000, you wrote:
>At 8:53 pm -0800 22/11/98, Josh Brandt-Young wrote:
>>On Sun, 22 Nov 1998 19:26:57 -0500 Nik Taylor <fortytwo@...> writes:
>>
>>>> What would the construction used in Modern Greek and Romanian to
>>>replace
>>>> the infinitive be called in linguistics terminology?
>>>>
>>>> Example: Greek "thelo na pao" (I want that I go) for "I want to go."
>>>
>>>Isn't that the subjunctive?
>>
>>In this case, yes, but not universally: the subjunctive is only used in
>>this case when referring to a perfective action. The indicative is used
>>in the same situation to refer to an event in process: "Thelo na piyeno"
>>means "I want to be going."
>
>Till some time in the 1980s IIRC both 'pao' & 'piyeno' were called
>"subjunctive" in these clauses by purists and, apart from the 1st person
>sing., the endings of the "present indicative" & the "present subjunctive"
>were spelt differently by purists.  That nonsense seems have almost
>entirely to have disappeared - tho I expect some purists still adhere to
>it.  I question very much whether the subjunctive/ indicative distinction
>had any real meaning in modern Greek - but that's another story.
>
>>What I'm wondering is whether there's a name for this entire *type* of
>>construction.
>
>It a 'noun clause' (or 'nominal clause').  Here it is the direct object of
>'thelo'.  Such clauses can also be used as subject of a sentence, e.g.
>
        So I didn't have the right name. Yours is more logical, and more
'linguistic-like'. 'Completive' must be a grammarian term.

>einai pio efkolo na perpateis para na treheis =3D
>it is easier to walk than to run.
>Walking is easier than running.
>
>In Greek such clauses may even be preceeded by the definite article, as
>nouns are and as the infinitive often was in ancient Greek, and the clause
>may then be governed by a preposition, e.g.
>
>einai kourasmenos ap to min koimatai   ['min' =3D mu eta nu]
>He is tired from not sleeping.
>
        Very interesting! A little bit like my Azak where noun clauses use
verbs with suffixes that are the same as case endings (even the ergative
when the noun clause is the subject of a transitive verb).

>Ray.
>
>
                                                Christophe Grandsire
                                                |Sela Jemufan Atlinan C.G.

"R=E9sister ou servir"

homepage: http://www.bde.espci.fr/homepage/Christophe.Grandsire/index.html