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Re: Voiced Velar Fricative

From:Christophe Grandsire <christophe.grandsire@...>
Date:Friday, December 20, 2002, 13:13
En réponse à Sally Caves <scaves@...>:

> > Aren't the "r"s in both French and German considered voiced velar > fricatives > of sorts?
No, they are voiced *uvular* fricatives, further back in the mouth. They differ slightly; I've heard the French "r" described as
> a > "uvular scrape."
I'd personally associate an "uvular scrape" to the uvular trill, which used to be the normal pronunciation of the French "r" and still survives in Parisian dialect. And some Germans gutterally trill their "r"s, while
> leaving them off when they occur finally.
So German also has instances of the voiced uvular trill? I didn't know that, although it sounds logical to me, since in both languages the "r" evolved from a former alveolar trill, and the best way from an alveolar trill to an uvular fricative is through a stage of uvular trill.
> "r"s in > French and German. The voiced velar fricative occurs in the Teonaht > alphabet, but it is only very rarely used, along with a number of > sounds > that have graphic representation in the Renuon (possibly there for the > spelling of foreign words) (or because Sally Caves got too slap-happy in > her > salad days). >
LOL. Of course, as you can imagine, Maggel has the voiced velar fricative :)) (as well as the voiceless velar fricative, the voiced velar approximant - neat sound by the way :))) - and a series of rhotics: alveolar trill, alveolar flap, alveolar approximant, uvular fricative - and probably the uvular trill, but not phonemically as the others -). Christophe. Take your life as a movie: do not let anybody else play the leading role.


John Cowan <jcowan@...>
Sally Caves <scaves@...>