Re: "Proposed IPA" characters not in Unicode

Paul Bennett wrote:
>However, I discovered last night, while rolling these posts around in my
>mind, that I can produce a velar trill (though it sounds *horrible*) and
>thus a labiovelar trill. Making that into a doubly-articulated flap/tap
>might take work, but I think it might be worth it...
Are you sure it's a strictly velar trill, not a velarized uvular trill or
some sort of a gargle effect? It's not supposed to be possible to trill the
dorsum. Makes me wonder why the IPA still leaves the palatal trill as
"possible but not attestested" tho.

A _velopharyngeal_ trill does exist, however. (That's where you have the
velum as the activ articulator. It sounds like snoring, or snorting maybe.)

>I'm a fan of /v`/ due to the "rhotic" nature of taps & flaps, retroflexes
>and rhotaicized vowels. There's a certain graphic
>similarity, too. However, this gets religious fairly quickly
>(based on past experience), so watch out.
That looks initially good, but not so much after realizing that it's also
possible to rhotacize /v/ directly. But that could however maybe be
transcribed as a dubbelpronunciation /vr\`)/.

CXS doesn't use asterisks for anything, does it? /v*/ might be a suitable
ad-hoc transcription too, as I think one of the non-SAMPA ASCII-IPAs employs
asterisks for trills more generally, even.

>Anyway, /l\/ seems like an eminent choice (though absent from CXS AFAICT)
>for the alveolar lateral flap, which is the "long leg turned r"
>in IPA, though in IPA it's IIRC deprecated as "not attested as
>distinctive", which only adds to the confusion. Still, CXS is concerned
>with attestation in conlangs at least as much as natlangs.
As well as phoneTic transcription.

>Regardless, it still leaves the question open for the fricative set. The
>/_0/ diactritic seems like a decent option, but it's nonsatisfactory
>(to me) in the long term).
>Paul
I should maybe mention that Z-SAMPA has all sorts of symbols for lateral
fricativs. Listing in voiced/voiceless pairs; POAs rfx-pal-vel-uv: /K\` K`
6\ C\ V\ F\ Q\ q\/

....and then there's canIPA, which has diacritic-less (or at least
floating-diacritic-less) symbols for just about every possible sound. It
uses versions of the belted lateral symbols with the belt reversed for
voiced frics. I have no idea how he's implemented the symbols, however.

John Vertical

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