Re: "conlanger" en Français?

At 2:20 pm +0100 6/5/00, And Rosta wrote:
>Ray:
[...]
>> Someone - Was it Caudio? - coined IIRC 'glossopoeta' as the Italian
>> for conlanger.  In French that'd be 'glossopoète', or 'glossopoet'
>> in English.
>
>The term was independently coined by, in chronological order, Steve
>Deyo (former editor of _Glossopoeic Quarterly_ and very occasional
>and transitory member of this list), me, and Claudio.
Not quite - Claudio's word is 'glossopoiesi' in Italian, which would be
'glossopoesis' in English.

In fact, recently I've seen on this list:
glossopoesis
glossopoesia
glossopoeia

The 1st & 3rd are quite 'legitimate' Greek derivatives; the middle one is,
I guess, a conflation of both & is not warranted by Greek or Latin usage.

All the variants are derived from Greek _glo:ssa_ (tongue, language) and
derivatives the verb _poeo:_ (I make).

The ancient Greek _poie:sis_ (abstract noun: 'making', 'fashioning';
especially 'making of verse') was Latinized as _poe:sis_ (3rd dec. = poesy,
poetry), and Greek _poie:te:s_  (maker, fashioner, maker of verse) was
Latinized as _poe:ta_ (poet); hence Claudio's Italian coinages:
glossopoiesi (conlanging); glossopoeta (conlanger), glossopoeti
(conlangers).

_Poesia_, which I have come across as a girl's name (she pronounced it
/'pOIzI@/, is presumably mock Latin back formation from French _poésie_
which is actually derived from Latin _poesis_.

Although a noun *poiia is not found in Greek, the morpheme -poiia is found
in compounds, e.g.
dramatpoiia 'dramatic composition'
ko:mo:idopoiia 'writing of comedies'
logopoiia 'tale-telling', 'newsmongering', 'gossiping'
mythopoiia 'making of fables'
trago:idopoiia 'writing of tragedies'
also -
artopoiia - bread-making
oinopoiia - wine-making
etc.

Greek diphthong _oi_ was Romanized as _oe_ thus the suffix would, indeed,
be -poeia.  Indeed from _mythopoiia_, English has the derivatives
_mythopoeic_ /mIT@'pi:Ik/ (adj.) "myth-making", and _mythopoeist_
"myth-maker".

Hitherto, I've used 'glossopoesis' (and not being happy with 'glossopoet');
but after examining things, on balance I now favor:

glossopoeia - conlanging (noun)
glossopoeic - of or pertaining to conlanging
glossopoeist - conlanger

>I wonder why we all coined _glossopoeia_, rather than _glottopoeia_.
>After all, 'linguistics' is _glottology_ rather than _glossology_.
Chamber's dictionary give _glossology_ as an alternative to _glottology_.
It might have been the influence of _glossolalia_ perhaps.

_glo:ssa_ was became the common Greek Koine form & remains the same till
today (except modern Greeks make no phonemic distinction between the
ancient long & short vowels and most, tho not all, no longer geminate
consonants).  _glo:tta_ was the Attic form.

Of course it may have been that you were all influenced by the fact
'glossopoeia' (or strictly _glo:ssopoiia_) was found in ancient Greek  :)

But the word meant '(the) making of mouth pieces [for pipes, flutes etc]'


[snip]
>
>> I guess Latin for "conlanger" would've been 'lingifex'
>
>not _linguifex_?
Indeed it should be - sorry for the typo  :=(

>> (gen. linguificis), with a derived noun 'linguificium' conlanging".
>> How does 'linguifice' sound as a possible French form?
>
>It sounds fine also as an English word.
Yep - linguifice /'lINgwIfIs/ would mean 'conlanging'.  Apparently
'ponticium' lives on in military parlance as 'pontifice' (bridge-building);
and 'articium' lives on as 'artifice.

But what about the noun for conlanger?

Latin 'pontifex' survives in English both as 'pontifex' (with Latin plural:
pontifices /pOn'tIfIsIz/) and as 'pontiff', but only with derived meanings
and not the original meaning of "bridge-maker".  *liguiff would hardly do!
Linguifex (plural: linguifices) is better, but I can't see it catching on.
I think that in line with 'artificer' from 'artifice', 'linguificer' is
probably the best one could do.

One of our francophone list members suggested 'liguificier' as French for
conlanger.  Somehow 'liguificier' and 'le linguifice' seem to go better in
French than the corresponding terms do in English.

I think I'll stay with the Greek derived forms I gave above.

Ray.


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A mind which thinks at its own expense
will always interfere with language.
                   [J.G. Hamann 1760]
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