Re: Fruitcakes was Re: Kentum/satem

Maarten van Beek wrote:
(replying to Hanuman Zhang)
>> >In Dutch we have a word for this: "Geuzennaam"; you take the (insulting)
>> >name the enemy gives you and use it proudly as your own weapon!
>>
>>     What's the X-SAMPA for this wonderful linguistic bon-bon?
>
>Well, in my dialect it would be something like ['x@\s@"nam], where @\
should
>be rounded instead of unrounded (but I don't know the X-Sampa for a rounded
>close-mid central vowel. ' indicates primary and " secondary stress (I know
>this is not X-SAMPA standard).
I've always assumed Du. |eu| was pretty much the same as French |eu|, so
"o-slash", which is also what my (older) dictionary gives.  Apparently the
first part geuzen- means "beggars", so "beggars' name" (?).  (BTW is your
medial [-s-] correct, or a typo???)

The dict. is Kramers' Engels Woordenboek, 22d printing 1953.  Quite clearly,
judging from evidence on this List, pronunciation has changed a good bit
over the last 50 years-- or more, who knows. The pronunciations given could
well be left over from the 1st printing, whenever that was.....But for good
or ill, I've never had to speak the language, just read it, and my earliest
attempts to pronounce words (in 19th C. spelling too) would have made your
skin crawl.

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