Re: Banin again

En réponse à Luís Henrique <luisb@...>:

>
> >Well, in French <un> is a single nasal vowel /9~/, so it
> >doesn't correspond to English u in but. What kind of sound are
> >you trying to describe?
>
> The French one. English does not have nasal voewels. The u in but is the
> nearest I could find; perhaps it would be better described as "like u in
> 'but', but nazalised"? Or is this nonsense?
>
No, it's a good way to describe it, as nasalisation can theoretically affect any
vowel.

>
> >> c and g sound as French /cr/ and /gr/ before a in some places.
>
> >Those ones are quite strange. Is there a reason why in some >dialects c
> and g sound like /cr/ and /gr/?
>
> I think yes, being c and g "back" (velar) stops and a a "back" vowel,
> the
> stops become affricated. But perhaps "French /cr/" is not a good
> description.
> The thing hears someting like /k/, followed by German /ch/, followed by
> /a/. Is this more understandable?
>
Oh yeah! Now I understand it. I've already heard about velarization of stops
followed by a! Now this kind of affrication seems very sensible to me. I always
forget that a is often rather back in most languages (it is not the case in
French, where the surviving /a/ used to be contrastive with a back /A/, and thus
is quite fronted - even in Old French, /a/ was so front that it in some cases
changed into /ie/ (Bartsh effect) -).

>
> Well, nobody said that a co-incidence should be composed by completely
> independent
> incidences. :-)
>
:)

Christophe.