Re: Pablo is back, Job, Argentina, Relay, Lord of the Rings

On Wed, 9 Jan 2002 15:05:53 EST
Elliott Lash <AL260@...> wrote:

>  Stephen Mulraney <ataltanie@...> writes:
>
> > On Wed, 9 Jan 2002 06:50:21 -0500
> > John Cowan <cowan@...> wrote:
> >
> >
> [snip snip]
>
> > > No, "craban" pl. "crebain" means "crow", all right.
> >
> > Ah yes... plural formed by 'narrowification' of the vowels. ;)
> > (though I prefer to call it 'caoilification', mar is ainm an saghas
> > focail seo 'caoil' ;))
>
> Hmm, I wish I hadn't left my Irish Book at home. But, what I think you're saying
> is that you've confused umlaut with the palatilization in Irish of consonants
> represented by the vowels <i> and <e> placed next to the consonants. This is
> not what's going on here.
>
> crebain is pronounced /krEbajn/ not /kr'Eban'/ (which ' indicating palatalization).
> This is an umlaut plural derived from *krabani(apparently, tho I can't find
> it in the Etymologies in The Lost Road). The Irish descendent of this would
> be: *crabhain I think. Or if Syncope occured in this word (I'm not sure of
> the rules on Syncope in Irish), it would have been *craibhne or something.
> Anyway, basically this is not palatalization in the case of Sindarin.
>
Ah, I see. I was being blinded by the orthography - I had to read your mail
several times before I copped what you were saying. Palatalisation != umlaut!
Ok, silly me. Hey, I've learned something about Gaeilge AND Sindarin ;)

s.