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Re: French reform (Re: C.Thalmann, & #1)

From:Joe <joe@...>
Date:Monday, April 11, 2005, 7:29
damien perrotin wrote:

> Skrivet gant Joe: > >> Peter Kolb wrote: >> >>> I hope the diacritic marks show up properly. If not then as such î is >>> i^, ï >>> is i:, and ö is o: . >>> >>> On Sun, 10 Apr 2005 08:53:38 +0100, Joe <joe@...> wrote: >>> >>> >>>>> Some more for the why-reform: >>>>> >>>>> >>> English Normal French Transliteration -> Reformed French >>> >>> >>>>> He is sitting: Il est assis /ay-tah-see/ -> **Ae tasï, **Aet >>>>> asï? >>>>> She is sitting: Elle est assise /ay-tah-seez/ -> **Ae tasïs, >>>>> **Aet asïs? >>>>> Why so different a spelling but so same a sound? >>>>> >>>>> >>> >>> >>> >>>> Erm, I suspect that it's assuming you know how to pronounce 'il' and >>>> 'elle', and so is skipping to the verbal construction. 'est' being >>>> pronounced [et]. >>>> >>>> >>> >>> I am not assuming that I know how to pronounce the above but whether >>> the >>> author (Joseph Lemaître) knows how to pronounce the above. The above >>> and the >>> below are correct transliteration as given by the author. >>> >>> >> >> No, I mean, it doesn't show 'il' and 'elle' on the transliteration, >> because it's assuming that you already know about that. So the >> radically different pronunciation isn't really that different - the only >> difference is assis > assise [assi]>[assiz]. >> >> The problem, I think, with any French reform is that it tends to treat >> each seperate word, as...well, seperate words. If they were treated as >> morphemes, the whole thing would be much clearer. >> >> Your sentences, in my preferred idea of reform would become 'i etassi' >> and 'el etassiz', respectively, where the prefix 'et-' is a kind of >> verbaliser. However, before a consonant, the 't' of the prefix is >> elided. 'i emãzhe' (he is eaten), and of course, 'el emãzhe'. >> >> Or something like that. Not being French, I'm somewhat unreliable. >> > Well, a few remarks from a native speaker : > - I would never say 'i etassi' but 'il etassi' (if I mean 'he's > sitting') or 'i yetassi" (if I mean 'is sitting in it')
Noted. It was just an anglophone's approximation, after all.
> - in 'i emãzhe' the first e is not the same phonem as the second, > but this may be a feature of my dialect
Ah, interesting. What is the first, in your dialect?
> -'pahr-lay frahN-sai' doesn't only sound anglocentric but also > plain wrong as 'parlez' is pronounced 'parle', unless you mean "spoke". > Also, what the use of the h. Length is irrelevant in modern French > (unless you happen to be from Belgium, that is) >
I think that's a pronunciation guide for Anglophones.


Jean-François Colson <fa597525@...>
damien perrotin <erwan.arskoul@...>